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Post by Lagger on Aug 28, 2017 12:47:05 GMT -6
I've been bad in not uploading status images, the build is progressing, here's the current state of play:
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Post by Admin on Aug 28, 2017 15:47:13 GMT -6
This is looking my friend
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Post by Lagger on Aug 29, 2017 12:51:30 GMT -6
Getting very close to first start up now. Jobs left to do before I make an attempt:
1) Coolant system - just need to connect the downpipe and then fill the system. 2) Engine Oil and Filter 3) Differential fill with oil 4) Air sensors to connect and fit 5) Sort out the cable-salad in the battery box and check everything is connected, check all fuses in fuse box and the separate holders. 6) Fit Fuel pump with new gasket into tank and assorted fuel lines (all new available now) 7) Fit the tank and connect the instrument panel etc 8) Fit clutch slave and fill & bleed the system 9) RH side covers to fit once the clutch slave is done and the wiring tucked away neatly 10) Fit the exhaust system 11) Fit the battery 12) Add some fuel and switch on - listen for fuel pump pressurising. Crank engine over a few times with plugs removed to circulate oil properly. 13) If step 12 goes well then fingers crossed that lucky thirteen is the moment of truth.
Hopefully I'll get this little shopping list finished tomorrow and I'll be able to report something here.....
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Post by Lagger on Aug 30, 2017 13:03:29 GMT -6
Done a shed load of more work today, getting very close now but I found out that I'm missing a small piece of the fuel line (the high pressure part that links the line from the fuel tank to the inlet, about 2 inches long) Still need to fit the exhausts, I'm going to do that tomorrow. I filled the coolant system - no leaks detected! I also filled the oil but I found a leak - guess where? Yup, from the generator cover! That means that one of my home made gaskets isn't sealing properly so I've ordered an inner and an outer gasket from Kawa and will fit these when they arrive. Meantime I finished all the electrickery connection and just for giggles I connected the battery. Everything works as it should, engine turns over, all warning lights work, odometer reads 32447 miles - first time I've been able to power it up to see. All that means though is that the clocks have been on a bike that's done that mileage, I've no idea how many miles my bike has actually done. I'd love to zero the odometer but that's a whole other story. Here's the latest mock-up - I need to remove the tank again to do the fuel lines but it's getting there now.
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Post by Lagger on Aug 30, 2017 13:04:01 GMT -6
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Post by Lagger on Aug 31, 2017 15:13:58 GMT -6
Quick update, exhausts fitted, everything connected but I'm missing one small piece of the fuel line. I've ordered this but it's on back order from Japan which means a delay of 2 - 3 weeks, very frustrating!
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Post by Admin on Aug 31, 2017 19:10:22 GMT -6
What do you need
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Post by Lagger on Sept 1, 2017 0:10:15 GMT -6
Short metal flanged pipe #32153-1414 I'm going to see what i can source as amake-do until the proper one gets here from Japan
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Post by Admin on Sept 1, 2017 0:11:49 GMT -6
Short metal flanged pipe #32153-1414 I'm going to see what i can source as amake-do until the proper one gets here from Japan I got all that stuff
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Post by Lagger on Sept 1, 2017 0:40:48 GMT -6
Short metal flanged pipe #32153-1414 I'm going to see what i can source as amake-do until the proper one gets here from Japan I got all that stuff Can we work something out? Postage from USA to UK is likely a killer though. I'm going to my local gas fitter this morning, they stock a load of different pipes and I'll probably be able to find something to work, it's only so I can run the bike, I still need to get brakes so I can't go riding just yet anyway.
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Post by Lagger on Sept 2, 2017 8:41:08 GMT -6
Frustration! Bike is now fully assembled and ready to start. Won't start, traced fault to no spark and I'm now going through the wiring very carefully doing tests everywhere. Junction box is ok- passed interlock tests. Need to check vehicle down sensor, coil pick ups, plugs, ignition coils and wiring etc
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Post by Lagger on Sept 2, 2017 11:43:44 GMT -6
Hmm, need some help I think. Checked everything I can think of, found two things. Output wire 44 from the ECU reads 9.6V instead of battery voltage, 43 gives full battery voltage. Both should read battery voltage- these are the outputs for the ignition coils. Not too concerned about that one though because the FI check light extinguishes after 2 seconds which should indicate that both DFI and ignition systems are OK. Now I possibly found a more serious issue - crankshaft pick ups. Both pass resistance tests but I get zero volts out when cranking, zero from front and rear. They should read about 2.2 volts. I measured using a multi meter but I don’t have a peak voltage adapter so maybe this is why I get zero readings (actually I'm pretty sure that the issue is my lack of a peak voltage adapter rather than a problem with pick-ups themselves) I changed the outer cover assembly together with coil and pick ups, tried again but still get zero volts. Now I'm scratching my head, could this be something to do with using the Meanstreak flywheel? (engine was from a classic - see my thread on generator issues for details on this) I don't really want to change the flywheel again and I can't see how this would cause the issue anyway, both outer generator covers look identical anyway. Any ideas?
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Post by Lagger on Sept 2, 2017 13:30:36 GMT -6
Hmmm, just been checking part numbers online, it seems that the Meanstreak outer cover is unique to that model which makes me think that the pick ups are located possibly differently to other models. Admin - Colin do you have any knowledge of this? The covers will all fit but if the pick ups are in a different location this would explain my no spark situation
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Post by Admin on Sept 2, 2017 20:46:48 GMT -6
Hmmm, just been checking part numbers online, it seems that the Meanstreak outer cover is unique to that model which makes me think that the pick ups are located possibly differently to other models. Admin - Colin do you have any knowledge of this? The covers will all fit but if the pick ups are in a different location this would explain my no spark situation Measure how deep in the cover the pick ups are. Measure how much the trigger is away from inner cover. This should be the same. The same as the center of pick up to center of trigger. If that is the same, what is your battery voltage? No load and cranking.
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Post by Lagger on Sept 3, 2017 1:39:14 GMT -6
Hmmm, just been checking part numbers online, it seems that the Meanstreak outer cover is unique to that model which makes me think that the pick ups are located possibly differently to other models. Admin - Colin do you have any knowledge of this? The covers will all fit but if the pick ups are in a different location this would explain my no spark situation Measure how deep in the cover the pick ups are. Measure how much the trigger is away from inner cover. This should be the same. The same as the center of pick up to center of trigger. If that is the same, what is your battery voltage? No load and cranking. Good thinking! Why couldn't I have thought of that? I'll get measuring sticks out this morning! thanks for the tip, I'll report back later
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Post by Lagger on Sept 3, 2017 6:27:08 GMT -6
Right, made some measurements, results are:
Classic flywheel trigger length =8.3cm Meanie flywheel trigger length =7.7cm (both measurements ignoring radius, i.e. End to end length) which means that the Meanstreak trigger is 0.5cm shorter than the Classic version. Pick up mid point to outer cover edge =3.1cm Trigger mid thickness to inner cover edge =3.1cm
Battery load free voltage 12.3V (rather low) Battery cranking voltage 7.6V (bloody low!) I think i need a new battery! Even with a booster battery in parallel the cranking voltage was dropping to around 9V.
Am I right in thinking that if the cranking voltage is too low the ECU will not initiate the ignition?
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Post by Admin on Sept 3, 2017 6:52:29 GMT -6
Right, made some measurements, results are: Classic flywheel trigger length =8.3cm Meanie flywheel trigger length =7.7cm (both measurements ignoring radius, i.e. End to end length) which means that the Meanstreak trigger is 0.5cm shorter than the Classic version. Pick up mid point to outer cover edge =3.1cm Trigger mid thickness to inner cover edge =3.1cm Battery load free voltage 12.3V (rather low) Battery cranking voltage 7.6V (bloody low!) I think i need a new battery! Even with a booster battery in parallel the cranking voltage was dropping to around 9V. Am I right in thinking that if the cranking voltage is too low the ECU will not initiate the ignition? Charge battery. You will have zero spark if voltage drops that low. Trigger length isn't a concern. Trigger length is 55 deg in length give or take. Injectors fire off 60 deg before tdc. The trailing edge of trigger is 5 deg btdc. Trigger length is just some info BTW lol.
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Post by Admin on Sept 3, 2017 6:56:40 GMT -6
Fwiw. Injectors will fire off with low battery. If you pull plugs you will find they will be wet. Charge battery, pull plugs, crank it over to clear out fuel.
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Post by Admin on Sept 3, 2017 9:26:25 GMT -6
Right, made some measurements, results are: Classic flywheel trigger length =8.3cm Meanie flywheel trigger length =7.7cm (both measurements ignoring radius, i.e. End to end length) which means that the Meanstreak trigger is 0.5cm shorter than the Classic version. Pick up mid point to outer cover edge =3.1cm Trigger mid thickness to inner cover edge =3.1cm Battery load free voltage 12.3V (rather low) Battery cranking voltage 7.6V (bloody low!) I think i need a new battery! Even with a booster battery in parallel the cranking voltage was dropping to around 9V. Am I right in thinking that if the cranking voltage is too low the ECU will not initiate the ignition? This is one of the most common cause of these scoots not starting and fouling plugs at startup. Engine cranks fine enough to start but no start condition. See it time and time again. If you ever want to play a little. There is a product called microsquirt. It is a stand alone ecu that is fully programmable. It will do everything under the sun. It does ignition, fuel, controls fan ect.
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Post by Lagger on Sept 3, 2017 9:59:07 GMT -6
Many thanks for the tips. I did have the battery on charge for two days before trying to start yesterday. I suspect the battery is defective (it was second hand and I bought it as a "doofer"). It charges too fast which in my experience is an indication of a bad battery. It charges fast but discharges even faster. I'll grab myself a new battery and try again when it arrives. I did pull a couple of the plugs - they didn't appear that wet but there is a strong fuel smell so I suspect the injectors are firing. I'll know more once I have a new battery. I've not heard of Microsquirt - I have in the past played with "Megasquirt" - I suspect this is a similar product. Cheers
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Post by Admin on Sept 3, 2017 10:35:41 GMT -6
Many thanks for the tips. I did have the battery on charge for two days before trying to start yesterday. I suspect the battery is defective (it was second hand and I bought it as a "doofer"). It charges too fast which in my experience is an indication of a bad battery. It charges fast but discharges even faster. I'll grab myself a new battery and try again when it arrives. I did pull a couple of the plugs - they didn't appear that wet but there is a strong fuel smell so I suspect the injectors are firing. I'll know more once I have a new battery. I've not heard of Microsquirt - I have in the past played with "Megasquirt" - I suspect this is a similar product. Cheers Same company. Micro is pre made in a sealed unit I had been thinking of tinkering with one before going carb. Lots of stuff to k own and set up on then.
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Post by Lagger on Sept 7, 2017 6:27:44 GMT -6
New battery delivered yesterday, I filled up with acid and it reads 12.75V before any charging. According to the blurb that came with it, it shouldn't need any charging if the Voltage reading is over 12.7 Now all I need is some time to play with it and see if I can bring the bike to life!
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Post by Lagger on Sept 9, 2017 12:58:11 GMT -6
A Big shout out to Colin and a massive thanks for all his help today. Between we think we've tracked down the cause of my no spark problem. We discovered that the Meanie and Classic flywheels are quite different - the outside diameter of the Meanie wheel is a fair bit smaller than the classic meaning you can't swap them over unless you swap over the outer cover as well - otherwise the flywheel trigger is too far away from the pick-ups resulting in no signal output to the ECU = no spark!
We were partly on this road earlier but then got side tracked by investigating the ignition coils before Colin took delivery of his new Classic flywheel and noted the smaller diameter, something I hadn't noticed when I swapped my Classic wheel for the Meanie one. So, tomorrow I'll be swapping the flywheel back over and hopefully, fingers crossed that will give me a spark and a running engine.
I might eventually have got there without Colin, I was planning to swap the flywheel back over simply because I couldn't find anything at all wrong but with his help we tracked down the issue much faster. Thanks again Colin!
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Post by Lagger on Sept 10, 2017 12:14:26 GMT -6
It's alive! Swapped the flywheel back, buttoned everything up again, hit the starter. It cranked for about 3 seconds then fired and ran. Running very sweet and smooth. Some stinky smoke appeared, it was just paint burning off the goat bladder. Otherwise no oil leaks, water leaks or any problems found so far. I'm very pleased. Special thanks to Colin for all his help, cheers!
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Post by Admin on Sept 11, 2017 10:44:20 GMT -6
A Big shout out to Colin and a massive thanks for all his help today. Between we think we've tracked down the cause of my no spark problem. We discovered that the Meanie and Classic flywheels are quite different - the outside diameter of the Meanie wheel is a fair bit smaller than the classic meaning you can't swap them over unless you swap over the outer cover as well - otherwise the flywheel trigger is too far away from the pick-ups resulting in no signal output to the ECU = no spark! We were partly on this road earlier but then got side tracked by investigating the ignition coils before Colin took delivery of his new Classic flywheel and noted the smaller diameter, something I hadn't noticed when I swapped my Classic wheel for the Meanie one. So, tomorrow I'll be swapping the flywheel back over and hopefully, fingers crossed that will give me a spark and a running engine. I might eventually have got there without Colin, I was planning to swap the flywheel back over simply because I couldn't find anything at all wrong but with his help we tracked down the issue much faster. Thanks again Colin! you would of got there my friend . you were on that track anyway.
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Post by Lagger on Sept 12, 2017 0:23:36 GMT -6
Turns out the stinky smoke coming from the goat's bladder was the exhaust cement I used. One of the sleeve gaskets was missing and the replacements I had where the wrong ones (came with the box of bits for the bike, they're much smaller diameter though). I cut a spiral slot in one of them and mounted it using exhaust assembly paste. The smoke was coming from the paste as it dried and hardened, it doesn't smoke anymore. I do have an oil leak though - from my favourite place, the generator outer cover. I expected this one though as I had to re-use the gasket when I swapped the flywheel back over. I'll order another and get that oil tight. I still need to do some tidying up of cable routing but I'm almost finished with the main job of re-assembly now. It's nice to have a bike that will start on the button, it's been a while coming. I started this project at the end of February this year.
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B46
New Member
Posts: 22
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Post by B46 on Sept 12, 2017 9:09:38 GMT -6
We were partly on this road earlier but then got side tracked by investigating the ignition coils before Colin took delivery of his new Classic flywheel and noted the smaller diameter, something I hadn't noticed when I swapped my Classic wheel for the Meanie one. What? I didn't think Colin used a flywheel - that's how his bike rev's so fast (at least compared to mine)!! Glad you have your bike up and running! Nice job!! Cheers!
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